UKTC Archive

Re: Engineers.

Subject: Re: Engineers.
From: Alan Reeves
Date: Feb 18 2001 21:06:05
OK Scott,
In your posting there's a very important point, which
I'd like to pick up on.

You have identified an area ie "Windthrow" which you
feel needs to be researched from the Arboricultural
standpoint.

I welcome any members of the arb. industry identifying
such areas where there is a shortfall of knowledge,
but at the end of the day, what is the industry going
to do about it?
Research, even the most fundamental and practical,
needs funding. 
Would you and others like to 
a) Identify ares of research for the next five years
and 
b) create and dip into a Research Fund War Chest to
finance such projects. ??
Colleges such as Myerscough will have numbers of
capable staff and students who would be capable of
delivering the goods, but at the end of the day such
work has to be financed.


--- Scott Cullen <dscottcul@xxxx.net> wrote: > Paul's
experience is not uncommon... in a general
sense.  My particular
recent experience involves wind loading and risk of
windthrow.  We
(arborists) are not competent to offer expert
opinions on enginering
mechanics.  Engineers should be but they either
completely shy away from
involvement in tree cases or make ultra-conservative
pronouncements based on
no understanding of tree biology or biomechanics. 
And they get believed.

Whose fault is that?  OURS!

Dealga pursued a thread quite some time ago about
true professional,
chartered status for arborists.  Until we get off
our rears and let go of
our insecurities and secular factions we will be
viewed as tradesmen (OK
politically correct tradespeople).  The second piece
of this puzzle is that
even our teaching academics no precious litttle
about these fields with
which to inform engineering professionals. Some may
relate to lack of basic
research.  Much relates to a provincial and
un-adventurous attitude.  Pick a
topic about which the conventional arboricultural
wisdom is "there's nothing
written about that."  Do a serious search and you're
likely to come up with
voluminous bibliographies.

Arborists tens to be hands on types.  They are not
typically comfortable
with books.  Engineers tend to be linear, literal,
b&W, cut and dried types.
Occassionally you'll find an imaginitive,
"out-of-the-box" thinker.  But we
have to have good protocols and data to present to
them or they will,
properly and prudently, fall back on a conservative
approach.
-----Original Message-----
From: Paul Hawksford <phawksford2000@xxxxxx.co.uk>
To: UK Tree Care <uktc@xxxxxxxxx.co.uk>
Date: Saturday, February 17, 2001 7:54 PM
Subject: RE: Tree Root Taper/Expert Opinion


Subsidence and settlement - One is recoverable the
other ain't!

I had a case recently, a registered consultant,
after discussions with
engineers, decided that seasonal monitoring had all
but indicated a number
of
Poplar trees as the culprit for minimal cracking,
later the engineers
decided
that the weight of the roof had actually caused the
problem (settlement).
Several trees were removed based on assumption.
It's typical, if the
engineer
decides trees are involved then the loss adjuster
will push for tree
removal -
the arboriculturist simply runs with the flow and
fells. In a TPO
situation, it
takes a hard nose Tree Officer to displace the run
- unfortunately usually
NOT!

Paul H. (sorry about the the grammar!!!!)


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=====
Alan Reeves
27 Garstang Road North
Wesham
Kirkham
Lancashire
PR4 3DB
01772 XXXXXX   07971 XXXXXX

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