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Re: The Poll case

Subject: Re: The Poll case
From: jonathan Mills
Date: Sep 06 2007 16:55:52
Personally, I think having one system it is a very dangerous route to take
our industry down. It will stifle intelligent discussion, creativity and
diversity which makes our industry strong.

QTRA has some very beneficial aspects so does Matheny & Clarke, I am not
very familiar with it M&C version.

I personally have tried many different systems and still find once you
know what the outcomes measures are the input data is varied by intelligent
arboricultural assessment to meet the out come you believe is required to
manage the risks identified.     Perhaps this is heresy but I have seen it
often enough by many different intelligent, qualified, etc etc
arboriculturalist.

Our industry can and probably does have an agreed set of philosophies or
principles for risk management from which QTRA and the like can spring from.

Jon


On 06/09/07, Chris Hastie <c.hastie@xxxxxxxxx.co.uk> wrote:

On 06/09/2007 07:02, John Flannigan wrote:
Secondly, and you have already alluded to it is that the industry
doesn't
need dozens of systems. It needs a unified voice. Its
customers/communities
need to understand what the hell Arborists talk about and if we all
disagree
on basic methodology or use idiosyncratic systems this simply cannot
happen.

John

I would whole heartedly agree that the industry needs to work towards an
industry accepted framework for managing risk in populations of trees.
As I've said, this was a point that came across strongly from Richard
Stead's presentation - do this and we have every chance of it leading
the law.

I'm not sure that QTRA is it. I certainly think QTRA moves our
understanding of tree risk on by orders of magnitude. It can and should
play a part, but I would be very concerned about the industry adopting,
lock, stock and barrel,  what is, in effect, a proprietary system.

I believe an agreed standard will need to be broad brush, to lay down
basic principles. These should include a structured assessment of risk
that accounts for likelihood of failure, occupation of target and likely
severity of damage. They should include a concept of balancing effort
against risk - of different types of inspection (eg drive-by / walk-by,
detailed), perhaps carried out by inspectors at different levels of
competence, with decisions on what gets inspected how informed largely
by target. They should include a concept of different return periods and
how those are decided. Of prioritising resources in taking action. Of
recording information. They should consider the process by which we come
to decide to inspect trees as much as how we inspect them when we get
there. They should, in as far as is possible, be evidence based and
reference published, peer reviewed material.

What they absolutely must not do is to prescribe excessive detail or tie
the industry into a particular commercial product. They should not
prescribe whether QTRA, Matheney or Clarke or The Magic Risk Crystal
Pendulum™ is used to assess risk. They should not prescribe which
software package data are stored in (unless, of course, it's one I've
written :) They should not prescribe return periods for particular
situations, nor should they prescribe action periods - these are local
decisions that are influenced by local constraints and can only be made
by local managers.

Chris Hastie

--
Find a tree surgeon at
http://www.findtreesurgeons.com/


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-- 
Jonathan Mills N. Dip. Arb. (Btec)
Arboricultural Consultancy
___________________________________
17 Westhead Road North
Cookley
Kidderminster
DY10 3TJ
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Tel: 01562 851054 or Mob: 07944 848051


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