Luke, thanks for those, haven't looked yet but will in a second.
I wasn't implying that no one knew of the co evolutions, only that fistulina
is a very specialised one amoung them, a wonderful and complex little fungi,
all IMO of course, just saying to avoid confusion.
I totally understand the need for evidence, and not evidence of the
anecdotal, pictorial or otherwise form, I am no expert nor will i ever claim
to be "great" i just love this subject and want to talk with anyone who has
an interest in such things and can help me discover the truth in the many
conflicts and missing informations that I find in my limited capacity at this
current time. Everyone of these papers/links you guys send me is a big part
of that journey, and I am so grateful for it.
as for ripped to shreds, its a personal thing, i take it personal, as i do
everything because everything is personal to me, i don't separate my work
from my life, as sad as it may seem for i gave up a lot of normal life in
order to be absorbed and selfish in this pursuit. I also have a great sense
of insecurity regarding my ability which is totally ridiculous because I know
i am a great arb, but criticism is still my kryptonite! Actually that's not
strictly true, its not criticality but condescension, I rise to that
disproportional! cant help it, its a growing pain thing long story! lol no
ones perfect huh!
I would love to do the work i need to do, it is like a great pain in me, that
i do not have the resources nor tools to do what i am truly capable of, and
one day i may risk all and build my own mini lab but for now I'm stuck
observing and taking photos and discussing with all who will discuss.
I am all too aware of the desperate undertone too, that comes from the fact I
have no means to win THE job, and 40 next year means i have to give serious
considerations to alternative occupations, that fills me with dread, its a
dark shadow looming, i mean what does one do as an unqualified climber when
its time to hang up the harness at least from a full on 5-8 hrs a day5-7 days
a week climbing pressure?
I am only worth my salary because of my productivity, as a climber im
priceless, anything else, well im up gainst a wall.
not for a lack of trying either, Ive not even made it to interview a good few
times!
I cant see myself stacking shelves or serving mc donalds!
hint hint
One of you lot has to be looking for a trainee consultant or surveyor? Oh
come on! lol failing that i make the best cup of tea!
tony
From: luketreescapes@xxxxxxxxxxx.com
To: uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info
Subject: RE: Ganoderma applanatum/australe on n.maple - implications
Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2011 17:40:12 +0000
Tony,
No one wants to rip anyone else to shreds. Some of what you and Gerrit are
suggesting is at variance from what we have learnt from other great
myco-arborists. Therefore we require evidence, not just circumstantial or
anecdotal observations.
Also no one is doubting that trees and fungi have co-evolved since the
beginning of time. That's why trees have evolved defence mechanisms and
fungi have evolved their preferred niches - the ecological arms race. I
suggest you and Gerrit read both Boddy and Rayner (1983)
(http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1469-8137.1996.tb01842.x/abstract)
and Pearce (1995)
(http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1469-8137.1996.tb01842.x/abstract).
Both are excellent papers on the relationships between decay fungi and
living trees but I'm sure that there is a lot more to learn. I suggest
that these describe the building blocks that you may potentially modify for
certain host - fungus relationships. Let's try not to throw the baby out
with the bath water.
Pearce also wrote a paper on long lived free radicals associated with
reaction zones - fascinating stuff.
Regards
Luke
-----Original Message-----
From: antony croft [mailto:hamadryad@xxxxxxxx.co.uk]
Sent: 29 December 2011 17:02
To: UK Tree Care
Subject: RE: Ganoderma applanatum/australe on n.maple - implications
Gerrit,
VS - 2) Not evidence on a microscopical level in a living tree (yet), but
assuming G. australe can, because of its (partially sterile) panic fruiting
just before or shortly after the tree dies and not being able to produce
(completely) fertile brackets from dead wood alone.>>
Your views, experience and guidance have been invaluable to me, you crossed
so many T's, dotted so many I's for me, you made sense of all my own
thoughts and findings, I have 100% faith. How might we go about proving
this to a very discerning crowd? We have some very septic, i mean sceptic
folk here. ha ha
and all-
We appear to have two subjects going on now, one (F. hepatica) deserves a
separate thread, I will start that with an album of photos.
As for Ganoderma australe, there are few things in life that I am this
confidant of, agreed that these theories and observations require rigorous
testing, but as newton said, all the greatest discoveries begun with a bold
guess.
and bold is me all over! ha ha (it hides my insecurities)
The reading of sporocarp production is every bit as valid as the reading of
the body language of trees, combined they tell more about the life of the
tree than is currently appreciated, both skills require a lot of time and
effort to learn, dont be dismissive of those skills. You Mr evans are the
reason i went and had a sulk, for patronising me with the term "prophecy"
in direct relation to my poor choice of words, I wont run away again.
I am gambling here, with my reputation, for if I am wrong I have no doubt i
will be ripped to shreds by many of you, as i am now but more so in 5 to 10
years, but I am willing to accept the odds that are so stacked in favour of
my understanding of many fungi/tree interactions.
why would anyone be so confidant in the face of overwhelming opposition,
when they are fighting so hard to be taken seriously in their field, and
risking the future of the very thing one is fighting tooth and nail for? i
am 40 next year and still a humble climber, so im putting my money on the
table.
I will predict two things, that Ganoderma australe will be found to be one
of the most capable and advanced of the basidiomycetes, and that Fistulina
hepatica will be found to be one of the longest and oldest co evolutionary
partners of Q robur/petrea and C. sativa and that in these hosts they have
massive morphological effects, that have shaped and formed some of the
greatest of our veteran oaks and Sweet chestnuts, also that under certain
antagonistic situations fistulina can and does have huge implications in
hazard assessment, particularly when antagonised by close interaction with
L. sulphureus in the main stem.
Oh, while were gambling, i will also predict that soft rot will be found as
a mode within other basidiomycetes (besides meripilus, Pholiota and
Inonotus variants and that it is a means of advancing colonisation as a two
mode approach, while the tree is asleep and unable to effect a "reaction"
CODIT is maybe just anotomical structure, not a defence, that reaction
zones are just that a reaction to infiltration and a tree must be actively
growing to facilitate such reactions.
so, theres my "prophecy" and i will accept the beatings due in the course
of time, if i am proved wrong! Which I doubt so much so because i am so
darn certain.
This science is relatively new, we cannot expect to find the truth in books
and others work alone, all that must begin in the field, with bold guesses
and intuition.
I am going to enjoy the next years of my work.
I apologise to all pedants for my lack of grammar, etiquette and format
etc, I wont deny that i have some very big faults in this area/arena but I
do believe with utter conviction in that which is of most importance, my
experience of working and studying trees and fungi.
dont underestimate the fungi just because someone told you to! i certainly
never will.
dont even get me started on colybia, auriularia mesenterica, pholiota
aurivella....
takes a deep breath, and releases the pin, FIRE IN THE HOLE!!!!
tony
From: david.evans@xxxxxxxxxxxx.co.uk
To: uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info
Subject: RE: Ganoderma applanatum/australe on n.maple - implications
Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2011 11:25:12 +0000
<<AV - 2) Are you saying you have evidence that G. adspersum/australe can
readily breach the reaction zone and/or boundary zone of functional xylem
and then colonise that wood in a tree with good vitality?
VS - 2) Not evidence on a microscopical level in a living tree (yet), but
assuming G. australe can, because of its (partially sterile) panic
fruiting just before or shortly after the tree dies and not being able to
produce (completely) fertile brackets from dead wood alone.>>
Hi Gerrit
If I read this correctly, you're saying you're 'reading' the fruiting
bodies, extrapolating from this, and making assumptions as to invasive
ability of G. adspersum/australe to breach reaction zones? Do you have
any opinions about the vitality of the tree and the functionality of the
xylem when you think reaction zones are being breached, or does this not
matter? Do you apply the same principles to boundary zones?
As mentioned previously, I'll start the 'panic fruiting' thread to
discuss this with part of a post you made after the message above.
Cheers
Acer ventura
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