UKTC Archive

Re: Tree professionalism WAS London tree WAS Tree hazard potential assessment study BREAKS Close calls

Subject: Re: Tree professionalism WAS London tree WAS Tree hazard potential assessment study BREAKS Close calls
From: John Hearne
Date: Jul 09 2018 12:13:13
I was a junior school with Blom Cooper the younger. I have some memory of a
birthday party at the house but no memory of any pearls of wisdom. Perhaps
I was too distracted by the jelly and ice cream.

On Mon, Jul 9, 2018 at 12:32 PM, Jim Quaife <jq@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.co.uk>
wrote:

Er ... that's Blom Cooper!  Just noticed the careless typo - no offence
mant to Sir Louis!
Jim

-----Original Message-----
From: uktc-request@xxxxxx.tree-care.info [mailto:uktc-request@lists.
tree-care.info] On Behalf Of Michael Richardson
Sent: 09 July 2018 12:26
To: UK Tree Care
Subject: Re: Tree professionalism WAS London tree WAS Tree hazard
potential assessment study BREAKS Close calls

A professional college also helps to define a professional. Absolutely.

Here in North America the only way to lose your ISA certifications or
qualifications is to stop paying.  In the Province of Ontario the Arborist
(and Utility Arborist) skilled trade qualification was lifetime based and
is now based on a yearly fee but no method of review for incompetence.

Michael Richardson B.Sc.F., BCMA
Ontario MTCU Qualified Arborist
Richardson Tree Care
Richardsontreecare.ca
613-475-2877
800-769-9183

  <http://www.richardsontreecare.ca/images/Tree_Doc_logo_email.png>


On Mon, Jul 9, 2018 at 5:35 AM, Wayne Tyson <wt750mv@xxxxxx.com> wrote:

One who questions--particularly his/her own assumptions first.

On Mon, Jul 9, 2018 at 1:29 AM, Jim Quaife <jq@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.co.uk>
wrote:

Many years ago I had the pleasure of sitting next to Sir Louis
Blom-Copper
(pivotal in the Dr Meadows case where a doctor strayed from his
professional discipline by talking about probability in evidence)
and I asked him what he regarded as a definition of a profession?
His answer was succinct:
The ability to complain.
That simple statement is beautifully precise because (assuming that
a complaint made to the professional association is dealt with
properly)
for
a complaint procedure to be exercised there has to be a whole raft
of policies, procedures, controls, standards and administration in
place.
I have yet to hear a better definition.
Jim

-----Original Message-----
From: uktc-request@xxxxxx.tree-care.info [mailto:uktc-request@lists.
tree-care.info] On Behalf Of Michael Richardson
Sent: 08 July 2018 20:42
To: UK Tree Care
Subject: Re: Tree professionalism WAS London tree WAS Tree hazard
potential assessment study BREAKS Close calls

I think one of the huge issues is that the terms professional and
professionalism are not well understood and organizations such as
ISA has co-opted the terms and lead hands-on tradesman (working tree
people) to believe there limited skill set is enough to consult etc.
Professional refers to a person or job that requires lots of
specialized education and professionalism to the traits needed.
Tree workers do not have this, nor do most arborists, consulting
arborists etc.

When you consider that a tree (an autotroph) is in many ways more
complicated compared with a human (hetertroph) surely an
understanding of trees, biology, physiology, mycology, physics, and
mechanics is needed to have any hope of being a good tree risk
assessor.  Further this
knowledge,
gathered through extensive study, must be supplemented with experience.

Arborists generally don't know that they don't know!

Michael Richardson B.Sc.F., BCMA
Ontario MTCU Qualified Arborist
Richardson Tree Care
Richardsontreecare.ca
613-475-2877
800-769-9183

  <http://www.richardsontreecare.ca/images/Tree_Doc_logo_email.png>


On Sat, Jul 7, 2018 at 5:45 PM, Wayne Tyson <wt750mv@xxxxxx.com> wrote:

 Thank you, Michael, for the highly *responsive* reply to my enquiry!
Unfortunately the tommyrot of which you speak is widespread here
in the US too.

When I was in the consulting business and working for various
agencies, it was my practice to retain people who knew what I
didn't know--in fact, I would even call in people who were better
than I even when I knew quite a bit about a particular subject.
When I took a course in Business Law, the professor said that he
was going to teach us how to know when we needed a lawyer and when
we didn't. It would seem to me that the arborist profession would
enhance its reputation if it drew the crucial distinctions between
knowledge and presumption, practice and sound theory (as
synthesized
knowledge) in action (educated observation), and pat answers vs
enquiry.
*Understanding* has no substitute; still it is always incomplete.
I question my own assumptions before questioning those of others,
but questioning a person who truly understands is always welcome.

Thank you also, for the recommended references. However, if I buy
one more book, my wife may divorce me for raiding our retirement
fund again. And, my cup runneth over. I may well run the risk in
this case,
however.

Wayne

PS: While I can barely spel mycologist, I hope I know when I need
one.
If I didn't have radar, I might resort to a mallet, followed by an
increment borer, or approved substitute. If radar was available,
that
would be best.
But I see this case as a shot across the bow--they should call you
in before another one of those old, old trees kills someone. Oh
yes, I almost forgot--would you and the crew care to discuss the
common misconceptions found in arborist's reports such as "The
tree was perfectly healthy but was rotten inside." And "The wind
(or God, or softened soil, or the uptake of water adding weight,
ad nauseam)
*caused* the tree to fall?



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-- 

Hearne Arboriculture

www.hearnearboriculture.com



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The UKTC is supported by Bosky Trees arboricultural consultancy
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