UKTC Archive

Re: Tree professionalism WAS London tree WAS Tree hazard potential assessment study BREAKS Close calls

Subject: Re: Tree professionalism WAS London tree WAS Tree hazard potential assessment study BREAKS Close calls
From: Wayne Tyson
Date: Jul 09 2018 17:23:02
The now-largely-forgotten backwoods American (USA) humorist, "Josh
Billings" (Henry Wheeler Shaw) once said something like "Th' wurst kinda
ignerance ain't s' much not knowin' as 'tis knowin' s' much tha 'tain't
so." Translation: The worst kind of ignorance is not so much not knowing as
it is knowing so much that is not true.

One might say that it has to do with the crucial distinction between
thinking and believing.

Wayne

On Mon, Jul 9, 2018 at 4:25 AM, Michael Richardson <
richardsontreecare@xxxxxx.com> wrote:

A professional college also helps to define a professional. Absolutely.

Here in North America the only way to lose your ISA certifications or
qualifications is to stop paying.  In the Province of Ontario the Arborist
(and Utility Arborist) skilled trade qualification was lifetime based and
is now based on a yearly fee but no method of review for incompetence.

Michael Richardson B.Sc.F., BCMA
Ontario MTCU Qualified Arborist
Richardson Tree Care
Richardsontreecare.ca
613-475-2877
800-769-9183

  <http://www.richardsontreecare.ca/images/Tree_Doc_logo_email.png>


On Mon, Jul 9, 2018 at 5:35 AM, Wayne Tyson <wt750mv@xxxxxx.com> wrote:

One who questions--particularly his/her own assumptions first.

On Mon, Jul 9, 2018 at 1:29 AM, Jim Quaife <jq@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.co.uk>
wrote:

Many years ago I had the pleasure of sitting next to Sir Louis
Blom-Copper
(pivotal in the Dr Meadows case where a doctor strayed from his
professional discipline by talking about probability in evidence) and I
asked him what he regarded as a definition of a profession?
His answer was succinct:
The ability to complain.
That simple statement is beautifully precise because (assuming that a
complaint made to the professional association is dealt with properly)
for
a complaint procedure to be exercised there has to be a whole raft of
policies, procedures, controls, standards and administration in place.
I have yet to hear a better definition.
Jim

-----Original Message-----
From: uktc-request@xxxxxx.tree-care.info [mailto:uktc-request@lists.
tree-care.info] On Behalf Of Michael Richardson
Sent: 08 July 2018 20:42
To: UK Tree Care
Subject: Re: Tree professionalism WAS London tree WAS Tree hazard
potential assessment study BREAKS Close calls

I think one of the huge issues is that the terms professional and
professionalism are not well understood and organizations such as ISA
has
co-opted the terms and lead hands-on tradesman (working tree people) to
believe there limited skill set is enough to consult etc.  Professional
refers to a person or job that requires lots of specialized education
and
professionalism to the traits needed.  Tree workers do not have this,
nor
do most arborists, consulting arborists etc.

When you consider that a tree (an autotroph) is in many ways more
complicated compared with a human (hetertroph) surely an understanding
of
trees, biology, physiology, mycology, physics, and mechanics is needed
to
have any hope of being a good tree risk assessor.  Further this
knowledge,
gathered through extensive study, must be supplemented with experience.

Arborists generally don't know that they don't know!

Michael Richardson B.Sc.F., BCMA
Ontario MTCU Qualified Arborist
Richardson Tree Care
Richardsontreecare.ca
613-475-2877
800-769-9183

  <http://www.richardsontreecare.ca/images/Tree_Doc_logo_email.png>


On Sat, Jul 7, 2018 at 5:45 PM, Wayne Tyson <wt750mv@xxxxxx.com> wrote:

 Thank you, Michael, for the highly *responsive* reply to my enquiry!
Unfortunately the tommyrot of which you speak is widespread here in
the US too.

When I was in the consulting business and working for various
agencies, it was my practice to retain people who knew what I didn't
know--in fact, I would even call in people who were better than I
even
when I knew quite a bit about a particular subject. When I took a
course in Business Law, the professor said that he was going to teach
us how to know when we needed a lawyer and when we didn't. It would
seem to me that the arborist profession would enhance its reputation
if it drew the crucial distinctions between knowledge and
presumption,
practice and sound theory (as synthesized
knowledge) in action (educated observation), and pat answers vs
enquiry.
*Understanding* has no substitute; still it is always incomplete. I
question my own assumptions before questioning those of others, but
questioning a person who truly understands is always welcome.

Thank you also, for the recommended references. However, if I buy one
more book, my wife may divorce me for raiding our retirement fund
again. And, my cup runneth over. I may well run the risk in this
case,
however.

Wayne

PS: While I can barely spel mycologist, I hope I know when I need
one.
If I didn't have radar, I might resort to a mallet, followed by an
increment borer, or approved substitute. If radar was available, that
would be best.
But I see this case as a shot across the bow--they should call you in
before another one of those old, old trees kills someone. Oh yes, I
almost forgot--would you and the crew care to discuss the common
misconceptions found in arborist's reports such as "The tree was
perfectly healthy but was rotten inside." And "The wind (or God, or
softened soil, or the uptake of water adding weight, ad nauseam)
*caused* the tree to fall?



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The UKTC is supported by Bosky Trees arboricultural consultancy
http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/




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To unsubscribe send mailto:uktc-unsubscribe@xxxxxx.tree-care.info

The UKTC is supported by Bosky Trees arboricultural consultancy
http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/