UKTC Archive

Re: Fungus on Lime - Ivy

Subject: Re: Fungus on Lime - Ivy
From: Brewster, Ian
Date: Oct 07 2019 10:15:48
Yes have read many an article/link relating to Ivy being an obnoxious exotic 
in the US.

What triggers the Ivy to be seen as problematic than just a hanger on? Could 
it be the growth is dictated by the change of soil microbes favouring Ivy 
over host tree growth, with possible thinning/deteriorating of canopy
 Anyhow off topic....

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.


-------- Original message --------
From: Jerry Ross <trees@xxxxxxxxxx.co.uk>
Date: 07/10/2019 09:01 (GMT+00:00)
To: UK Tree Care <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Subject: Re: Fungus on Lime - Ivy

Firstly, Ivy is an introduced species to America and like so many
introductions, causes problems that it doesn't cause in habitats where
it has evolved with other species that have a tendency to control or at
least limit its growth, or else live amicably with it.
Secondly, one of the ways trees manage to live amicably with it is (for
deciduous trees anyway) by limiting its capacity top grow and spread
through the summer by producing dense canopies, so the ivy is happy
enough climbing up the trunk, doing much of its photosynthesising (and
of course its fruiting)  in the winter months. It's only when the ivy
becomes more vigorous than the host tree, that is when the host is
losing vigour and beginning to decline, that the ivy can become a
problem by proliferating and spreading out onto the lateral branches
where it can start to smother the host's foliage. (It can be more
problematic on evergreens such as hollies and yew, as it has to grow
straight to the outside or tops of the tree to order to seek light, with
the result that it tends to suppress and smother the host tree at an
earlier stage.
SO... I suggest that ivy is not an cause of decline but a symptom,
albeit one which may exacerbate the situation.

That's my theory anyway.



On 07/10/2019 08:28, Brewster, Ian wrote:
It's interesting to note the suggestion that Ivy reduces airflow, raises 
humidity to promote disease. Though Ivy seemed to be drier beneath their 
waxy leaf cover... Whether disease was there prior to Ivy growth would be 
difficult to determine unless both tree and Ivy growth rings can be counted 
to see which one chemically reacted/grew first ... There seems to be a 
connection between decay and fruiting brackets and the presence of thick 
Ivy growth at the base of the thickest stem which is something I have often 
seen.
If Ivy promotes the cause then Perhaps thinning multiple strands to a few 
that are leafless and retaining the wildlife habitat aspect to assist with 
aerating the tree base (bit like thinning the crown of a fruit tree) may 
help reduce diseases such as these from taking hold.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.


-------- Original message --------
From: David Lonsdale <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Date: 06/10/2019 12:15 (GMT+00:00)
To: UK Tree Care <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Subject: RE: Fungus on Lime

Dear All,

Coniophora puteana, a well-known cause of wet-rot in timber, can degrade 
the outer layers of the bark of various tree species if humidity is high 
(typically near ground level). The underlying inner bark remains intact and 
eventually becomes exposed by the shedding of the decaying outer bark. The 
exposed inner bark usually looks smoother than the surrounding unaffected 
outer bark; hence the name 'smooth patch' for this condition.

DL

-----Original Message-----
From: uktc-request@xxxxxx.tree-care.info 
<uktc-request@xxxxxx.tree-care.info> On Behalf Of AV Arboriculture
Sent: 06 October 2019 11:11
To: UK Tree Care <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Subject: Re: Fungus on Lime

Hi Wayne,

That is interesting - do you know of any research that has shown 
saprophytes to consume tree bark? That was one of my main concerns.

Mike

Regards,

Mike Charkow
Principal Arboriculturist
______________________
Arbor Vitae Arboriculture Ltd

Planning surveys, Tree inspections, Bats in trees inspections, 
Arboricultural consultancy, Soil de-compaction, Root Investigation, 
Woodland Management.

[ mailto:info@xxxxxxx.co.uk | info@xxxxxxx.co.uk ] [ 
https://avtree.co.uk/<https://avtree.co.uk/><https://avtree.co.uk/<https://avtree.co.uk/>>
 | 
www.avtree.co.uk<http://www.avtree.co.uk><http://www.avtree.co.uk<http://www.avtree.co.uk>>
 ]
07917XXXXXX
Company Registration Number: SC413171

----- Original Message -----
From: "Wayne Tyson" <wt750mv@xxxxxx.com>
To: "uktc" <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Sent: Saturday, 5 October, 2019 22:53:14
Subject: Re: Fungus on Lime

Ivy tends to promote and maintain a higher humidity in such 
micro-environments, so perhaps its removal might discourage fungal 
development. Closer examination might reveal useful particulars. Sometimes 
saprophytes consume the bark, setting up conditions for entry into the 
heartwood, as well as set up conditions for parasitic species. Even loss of 
heartwood weakens the tree, which can appear to the casual observer to be 
"perfectly healthy."

I am speaking from experience in the USA only. Even in the relatively dry 
climate in which I live now, I have observed such phenomena in association 
with ivy. Some species appear to be more tolerant than others. In 
susceptible species, failure is often the result, even of those "perfectly 
healthy" ones. Any tree professional should perform all of the necessary 
investigations to secure as complete as possible analysis. (No offence to 
my UK listserv pals, but failure to follow those procedures seems to be 
more common than not here in the USA.)

Wayne

On Sat, Oct 5, 2019 at 1:34 PM Rupert Baker <rupert_baker@xxxxxxxx.co.uk>
wrote:

This looks like a fungus I've seen in humid situations at the base of
various species trees; if it is the same thing it is a harmless
saprophyte. Mind you, that is no the basis of a low-res photo...
Atb
Rupert
-----Original Message-----
From: uktc-request@xxxxxx.tree-care.info On Behalf Of AV Arboriculture
Sent: 05 October 2019 13:09
To: UK Tree Care <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Subject: Fungus on Lime

I think this is some form of dry rot - do you agree? It was growing on
two Lime trees under ivy. I didn't find any bark necrosis, though one
tree has a small amount of sapwood delignification (possibly
unrelated). Does anyone know the effects of this on trees?

Mike Charkow



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The UKTC is supported by Bosky Trees arboricultural consultancy
http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/<http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/><http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/<http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/>>




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It's interesting to note the suggestion that Ivy reduces airflow, raises 
humidity to promote disease. Though Ivy seemed to be drier beneath their 
waxy leaf cover... Whether disease was there prior to Ivy growth would be 
difficult to determine unless both tree and Ivy growth rings can be counted 
to see which one chemically reacted/grew first ... There seems to be a 
connection between decay and fruiting brackets and the presence of thick 
Ivy growth at the base of the thickest stem which is something I have often 
seen.
If Ivy promotes the cause then Perhaps thinning multiple strands to a few 
that are leafless and retaining the wildlife habitat aspect to assist with 
aerating the tree base (bit like thinning the crown of a fruit tree) may 
help reduce diseases such as these from taking hold.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.


-------- Original message --------
From: David Lonsdale <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Date: 06/10/2019 12:15 (GMT+00:00)
To: UK Tree Care <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Subject: RE: Fungus on Lime

Dear All,

Coniophora puteana, a well-known cause of wet-rot in timber, can degrade 
the outer layers of the bark of various tree species if humidity is high 
(typically near ground level). The underlying inner bark remains intact and 
eventually becomes exposed by the shedding of the decaying outer bark. The 
exposed inner bark usually looks smoother than the surrounding unaffected 
outer bark; hence the name 'smooth patch' for this condition.

DL

-----Original Message-----
From: uktc-request@xxxxxx.tree-care.info 
<uktc-request@xxxxxx.tree-care.info> On Behalf Of AV Arboriculture
Sent: 06 October 2019 11:11
To: UK Tree Care <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Subject: Re: Fungus on Lime

Hi Wayne,

That is interesting - do you know of any research that has shown 
saprophytes to consume tree bark? That was one of my main concerns.

Mike

Regards,

Mike Charkow
Principal Arboriculturist
______________________
Arbor Vitae Arboriculture Ltd

Planning surveys, Tree inspections, Bats in trees inspections, 
Arboricultural consultancy, Soil de-compaction, Root Investigation, 
Woodland Management.

[ mailto:info@xxxxxxx.co.uk | info@xxxxxxx.co.uk ] [ 
https://avtree.co.uk/<https://avtree.co.uk/><https://avtree.co.uk/<https://avtree.co.uk/>>
 | 
www.avtree.co.uk<http://www.avtree.co.uk><http://www.avtree.co.uk<http://www.avtree.co.uk>>
 ]
07917XXXXXX
Company Registration Number: SC413171

----- Original Message -----
From: "Wayne Tyson" <wt750mv@xxxxxx.com>
To: "uktc" <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Sent: Saturday, 5 October, 2019 22:53:14
Subject: Re: Fungus on Lime

Ivy tends to promote and maintain a higher humidity in such 
micro-environments, so perhaps its removal might discourage fungal 
development. Closer examination might reveal useful particulars. Sometimes 
saprophytes consume the bark, setting up conditions for entry into the 
heartwood, as well as set up conditions for parasitic species. Even loss of 
heartwood weakens the tree, which can appear to the casual observer to be 
"perfectly healthy."

I am speaking from experience in the USA only. Even in the relatively dry 
climate in which I live now, I have observed such phenomena in association 
with ivy. Some species appear to be more tolerant than others. In 
susceptible species, failure is often the result, even of those "perfectly 
healthy" ones. Any tree professional should perform all of the necessary 
investigations to secure as complete as possible analysis. (No offence to 
my UK listserv pals, but failure to follow those procedures seems to be 
more common than not here in the USA.)

Wayne

On Sat, Oct 5, 2019 at 1:34 PM Rupert Baker <rupert_baker@xxxxxxxx.co.uk>
wrote:

This looks like a fungus I've seen in humid situations at the base of
various species trees; if it is the same thing it is a harmless
saprophyte. Mind you, that is no the basis of a low-res photo...
Atb
Rupert
-----Original Message-----
From: uktc-request@xxxxxx.tree-care.info On Behalf Of AV Arboriculture
Sent: 05 October 2019 13:09
To: UK Tree Care <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Subject: Fungus on Lime

I think this is some form of dry rot - do you agree? It was growing on
two Lime trees under ivy. I didn't find any bark necrosis, though one
tree has a small amount of sapwood delignification (possibly
unrelated). Does anyone know the effects of this on trees?

Mike Charkow



--
The UK Tree Care mailing list
To unsubscribe send mailto:uktc-unsubscribe@xxxxxx.tree-care.info

The UKTC is supported by Bosky Trees arboricultural consultancy
http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/<http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/><http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/<http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/>>




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http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/<http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/><http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/<http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/>>



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http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/<http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/><http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/<http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/>>




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To unsubscribe send mailto:uktc-unsubscribe@xxxxxx.tree-care.info

The UKTC is supported by Bosky Trees arboricultural consultancy
http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/<http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/>
Yes have read many an article/link relating to Ivy being an obnoxious exotic 
in the US.

What triggers the Ivy to be seen as problematic than just a hanger on? Could 
it be the growth is dictated by the change of soil microbes favouring Ivy 
over host tree growth, with possible thinning/deteriorating of canopy
 Anyhow off topic....

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.


-------- Original message --------
From: Jerry Ross <trees@xxxxxxxxxx.co.uk>
Date: 07/10/2019 09:01 (GMT+00:00)
To: UK Tree Care <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Subject: Re: Fungus on Lime - Ivy

Firstly, Ivy is an introduced species to America and like so many
introductions, causes problems that it doesn't cause in habitats where
it has evolved with other species that have a tendency to control or at
least limit its growth, or else live amicably with it.
Secondly, one of the ways trees manage to live amicably with it is (for
deciduous trees anyway) by limiting its capacity top grow and spread
through the summer by producing dense canopies, so the ivy is happy
enough climbing up the trunk, doing much of its photosynthesising (and
of course its fruiting)  in the winter months. It's only when the ivy
becomes more vigorous than the host tree, that is when the host is
losing vigour and beginning to decline, that the ivy can become a
problem by proliferating and spreading out onto the lateral branches
where it can start to smother the host's foliage. (It can be more
problematic on evergreens such as hollies and yew, as it has to grow
straight to the outside or tops of the tree to order to seek light, with
the result that it tends to suppress and smother the host tree at an
earlier stage.
SO... I suggest that ivy is not an cause of decline but a symptom,
albeit one which may exacerbate the situation.

That's my theory anyway.



On 07/10/2019 08:28, Brewster, Ian wrote:
It's interesting to note the suggestion that Ivy reduces airflow, raises 
humidity to promote disease. Though Ivy seemed to be drier beneath their 
waxy leaf cover... Whether disease was there prior to Ivy growth would be 
difficult to determine unless both tree and Ivy growth rings can be counted 
to see which one chemically reacted/grew first ... There seems to be a 
connection between decay and fruiting brackets and the presence of thick 
Ivy growth at the base of the thickest stem which is something I have often 
seen.
If Ivy promotes the cause then Perhaps thinning multiple strands to a few 
that are leafless and retaining the wildlife habitat aspect to assist with 
aerating the tree base (bit like thinning the crown of a fruit tree) may 
help reduce diseases such as these from taking hold.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.


-------- Original message --------
From: David Lonsdale <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Date: 06/10/2019 12:15 (GMT+00:00)
To: UK Tree Care <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Subject: RE: Fungus on Lime

Dear All,

Coniophora puteana, a well-known cause of wet-rot in timber, can degrade 
the outer layers of the bark of various tree species if humidity is high 
(typically near ground level). The underlying inner bark remains intact and 
eventually becomes exposed by the shedding of the decaying outer bark. The 
exposed inner bark usually looks smoother than the surrounding unaffected 
outer bark; hence the name 'smooth patch' for this condition.

DL

-----Original Message-----
From: uktc-request@xxxxxx.tree-care.info 
<uktc-request@xxxxxx.tree-care.info> On Behalf Of AV Arboriculture
Sent: 06 October 2019 11:11
To: UK Tree Care <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Subject: Re: Fungus on Lime

Hi Wayne,

That is interesting - do you know of any research that has shown 
saprophytes to consume tree bark? That was one of my main concerns.

Mike

Regards,

Mike Charkow
Principal Arboriculturist
______________________
Arbor Vitae Arboriculture Ltd

Planning surveys, Tree inspections, Bats in trees inspections, 
Arboricultural consultancy, Soil de-compaction, Root Investigation, 
Woodland Management.

[ mailto:info@xxxxxxx.co.uk | info@xxxxxxx.co.uk ] [ 
https://avtree.co.uk/<https://avtree.co.uk/><https://avtree.co.uk/<https://avtree.co.uk/>>
 | 
www.avtree.co.uk<http://www.avtree.co.uk><http://www.avtree.co.uk<http://www.avtree.co.uk>>
 ]
07917XXXXXX
Company Registration Number: SC413171

----- Original Message -----
From: "Wayne Tyson" <wt750mv@xxxxxx.com>
To: "uktc" <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Sent: Saturday, 5 October, 2019 22:53:14
Subject: Re: Fungus on Lime

Ivy tends to promote and maintain a higher humidity in such 
micro-environments, so perhaps its removal might discourage fungal 
development. Closer examination might reveal useful particulars. Sometimes 
saprophytes consume the bark, setting up conditions for entry into the 
heartwood, as well as set up conditions for parasitic species. Even loss of 
heartwood weakens the tree, which can appear to the casual observer to be 
"perfectly healthy."

I am speaking from experience in the USA only. Even in the relatively dry 
climate in which I live now, I have observed such phenomena in association 
with ivy. Some species appear to be more tolerant than others. In 
susceptible species, failure is often the result, even of those "perfectly 
healthy" ones. Any tree professional should perform all of the necessary 
investigations to secure as complete as possible analysis. (No offence to 
my UK listserv pals, but failure to follow those procedures seems to be 
more common than not here in the USA.)

Wayne

On Sat, Oct 5, 2019 at 1:34 PM Rupert Baker <rupert_baker@xxxxxxxx.co.uk>
wrote:

This looks like a fungus I've seen in humid situations at the base of
various species trees; if it is the same thing it is a harmless
saprophyte. Mind you, that is no the basis of a low-res photo...
Atb
Rupert
-----Original Message-----
From: uktc-request@xxxxxx.tree-care.info On Behalf Of AV Arboriculture
Sent: 05 October 2019 13:09
To: UK Tree Care <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Subject: Fungus on Lime

I think this is some form of dry rot - do you agree? It was growing on
two Lime trees under ivy. I didn't find any bark necrosis, though one
tree has a small amount of sapwood delignification (possibly
unrelated). Does anyone know the effects of this on trees?

Mike Charkow



--
The UK Tree Care mailing list
To unsubscribe send mailto:uktc-unsubscribe@xxxxxx.tree-care.info

The UKTC is supported by Bosky Trees arboricultural consultancy
http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/<http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/><http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/<http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/>>




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http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/<http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/><http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/<http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/>>
It's interesting to note the suggestion that Ivy reduces airflow, raises 
humidity to promote disease. Though Ivy seemed to be drier beneath their 
waxy leaf cover... Whether disease was there prior to Ivy growth would be 
difficult to determine unless both tree and Ivy growth rings can be counted 
to see which one chemically reacted/grew first ... There seems to be a 
connection between decay and fruiting brackets and the presence of thick 
Ivy growth at the base of the thickest stem which is something I have often 
seen.
If Ivy promotes the cause then Perhaps thinning multiple strands to a few 
that are leafless and retaining the wildlife habitat aspect to assist with 
aerating the tree base (bit like thinning the crown of a fruit tree) may 
help reduce diseases such as these from taking hold.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.


-------- Original message --------
From: David Lonsdale <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Date: 06/10/2019 12:15 (GMT+00:00)
To: UK Tree Care <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Subject: RE: Fungus on Lime

Dear All,

Coniophora puteana, a well-known cause of wet-rot in timber, can degrade 
the outer layers of the bark of various tree species if humidity is high 
(typically near ground level). The underlying inner bark remains intact and 
eventually becomes exposed by the shedding of the decaying outer bark. The 
exposed inner bark usually looks smoother than the surrounding unaffected 
outer bark; hence the name 'smooth patch' for this condition.

DL

-----Original Message-----
From: uktc-request@xxxxxx.tree-care.info 
<uktc-request@xxxxxx.tree-care.info> On Behalf Of AV Arboriculture
Sent: 06 October 2019 11:11
To: UK Tree Care <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Subject: Re: Fungus on Lime

Hi Wayne,

That is interesting - do you know of any research that has shown 
saprophytes to consume tree bark? That was one of my main concerns.

Mike

Regards,

Mike Charkow
Principal Arboriculturist
______________________
Arbor Vitae Arboriculture Ltd

Planning surveys, Tree inspections, Bats in trees inspections, 
Arboricultural consultancy, Soil de-compaction, Root Investigation, 
Woodland Management.

[ mailto:info@xxxxxxx.co.uk | info@xxxxxxx.co.uk ] [ 
https://avtree.co.uk/<https://avtree.co.uk/><https://avtree.co.uk/<https://avtree.co.uk/>>
 | 
www.avtree.co.uk<http://www.avtree.co.uk><http://www.avtree.co.uk<http://www.avtree.co.uk>>
 ]
07917XXXXXX
Company Registration Number: SC413171

----- Original Message -----
From: "Wayne Tyson" <wt750mv@xxxxxx.com>
To: "uktc" <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Sent: Saturday, 5 October, 2019 22:53:14
Subject: Re: Fungus on Lime

Ivy tends to promote and maintain a higher humidity in such 
micro-environments, so perhaps its removal might discourage fungal 
development. Closer examination might reveal useful particulars. Sometimes 
saprophytes consume the bark, setting up conditions for entry into the 
heartwood, as well as set up conditions for parasitic species. Even loss of 
heartwood weakens the tree, which can appear to the casual observer to be 
"perfectly healthy."

I am speaking from experience in the USA only. Even in the relatively dry 
climate in which I live now, I have observed such phenomena in association 
with ivy. Some species appear to be more tolerant than others. In 
susceptible species, failure is often the result, even of those "perfectly 
healthy" ones. Any tree professional should perform all of the necessary 
investigations to secure as complete as possible analysis. (No offence to 
my UK listserv pals, but failure to follow those procedures seems to be 
more common than not here in the USA.)

Wayne

On Sat, Oct 5, 2019 at 1:34 PM Rupert Baker <rupert_baker@xxxxxxxx.co.uk>
wrote:

This looks like a fungus I've seen in humid situations at the base of
various species trees; if it is the same thing it is a harmless
saprophyte. Mind you, that is no the basis of a low-res photo...
Atb
Rupert
-----Original Message-----
From: uktc-request@xxxxxx.tree-care.info On Behalf Of AV Arboriculture
Sent: 05 October 2019 13:09
To: UK Tree Care <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Subject: Fungus on Lime

I think this is some form of dry rot - do you agree? It was growing on
two Lime trees under ivy. I didn't find any bark necrosis, though one
tree has a small amount of sapwood delignification (possibly
unrelated). Does anyone know the effects of this on trees?

Mike Charkow



--
The UK Tree Care mailing list
To unsubscribe send mailto:uktc-unsubscribe@xxxxxx.tree-care.info

The UKTC is supported by Bosky Trees arboricultural consultancy
http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/<http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/><http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/<http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/>>




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To unsubscribe send mailto:uktc-unsubscribe@xxxxxx.tree-care.info

The UKTC is supported by Bosky Trees arboricultural consultancy
http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/<http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/><http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/<http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/>>



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The UK Tree Care mailing list
To unsubscribe send mailto:uktc-unsubscribe@xxxxxx.tree-care.info

The UKTC is supported by Bosky Trees arboricultural consultancy 
http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/<http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/><http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/<http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/>>




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The UK Tree Care mailing list
To unsubscribe send mailto:uktc-unsubscribe@xxxxxx.tree-care.info

The UKTC is supported by Bosky Trees arboricultural consultancy
http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/<http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/><http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/<http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/>>
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The UK Tree Care mailing list
To unsubscribe send mailto:uktc-unsubscribe@xxxxxx.tree-care.info

The UKTC is supported by Bosky Trees arboricultural consultancy
http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/<http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/>
NPS
 



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The UK Tree Care mailing list
To unsubscribe send mailto:uktc-unsubscribe@xxxxxx.tree-care.info

The UKTC is supported by Bosky Trees arboricultural consultancy
http://www.boskytrees.co.uk/

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