UKTC Archive

Western Sp of Cupressus now Hesperocyparis

Subject: Western Sp of Cupressus now Hesperocyparis
From: Rupert Baker
Date: Jul 28 2020 17:24:22
Hi Julian, thanks for the link - I had a look at it when the international 
tree failure database was trying to get up & running - but it is dormant at 
least at the moment.

As an interesting aside, I see form it that the N american  'True' Cypresses 
are now reclassified into Hesperocyparis - one lives & learns.....

Atb
Rupert

-----Original Message-----
From: uktc-request@xxxxxx.tree-care.info On Behalf Of Julian Dunster
Sent: 28 July 2020 03:09
To: UK Tree Care <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Subject: Re: Hidden defects

There is such a data base. The California Tree Failure Database has been 
around a long time.

https://ucanr.edu/sites/treefail/

It is the only place that I know of where there is enough data to provide 
some statistically defensible predictions based on many hundreds of records. 
That being said they only have a few species really well tied down, but 
better than any where else that I have heard of.

On Behalf of Dunster and Associates Environmental Consultants Ltd.


Dr. Julian A Dunster R.P.F., R.P.P.., M.C.I.P., ISA Certified Arborist, ASCA 
Registered Consulting Arborist # 378, ISA Tree Risk Assessment Qualified 
Honourary Life Member ISA + PNWISA

North American distributor for Rinntech
www.dunster.ca
www.treelaw.info
www.rinntech.info

On Mon/7/27/2020 1:51 PM, Wayne Tyson wrote:
" . . . there are lessons to be learned from every tree that can be 
applied to the way we carry out our jobs."

I agree that if there was a central repository for a somewhat 
standardized but evolving, open-source post-failure assessment 
reporting system, and if more such assessments were done, that 
patterns might eventually emerge as data that should steadily improve the 
practice of tree failure assessments.

The phenomenon is both simple and multi-factorial. I never have 
declared any tree to be "safe." I have reported what I have observed 
and commented on whether the observations appear to signify a trend 
toward tree strengthening or weakening. I don't believe there is any 
basis for prosecuting a tree professional unless, perhaps, an opinion 
is rendered that the singular tree in question is "perfectly healthy" 
when a reasonable and knowledgeable person should have detected 
defects--but even then, I see it as a tort, not a crime, perhaps 
subject to civil action. I respectfully request a discussion concerning 
*the subject*, and relevant specifics.

Wayne

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 9:14 AM AV Arboriculture <mike@xxxxxxx.co.uk> wrote:

Apologies Jerry, I didn't see that.

Regards,

Mike Charkow
Principal Arboriculturist
______________________
Arbor Vitae Arboriculture Ltd

Planning surveys, Tree inspections, Bats in trees inspections, 
Arboricultural consultancy, Soil de-compaction, Root Investigation, 
Woodland Management.

[ mailto:info@xxxxxxx.co.uk | info@xxxxxxx.co.uk ] [ 
https://avtree.co.uk/ | www.avtree.co.uk ]
07917XXXXXX
Company Registration Number: SC413171

----- Original Message -----
From: "trees" <trees@xxxxxxxxxx.co.uk>
To: "uktc" <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Sent: Monday, 27 July, 2020 17:00:46
Subject: Re: Hidden defects

I addressed mine to both you and David so I don't see why you should 
feel singled out.
Also, you'd banged out another couple of one-liners by the time I'd 
formulated and sent my response.

Enough.


On 27/07/2020 16:52, AV Arboriculture wrote:
I agree Jerry; I have stepped down from the disfunctional thread and
made that clear in my last posts. Can I ask why you are singling me out?
Regards,

Mike Charkow
Principal Arboriculturist
______________________
Arbor Vitae Arboriculture Ltd

Planning surveys, Tree inspections, Bats in trees inspections,
Arboricultural consultancy, Soil de-compaction, Root Investigation, 
Woodland Management.
[ mailto:info@xxxxxxx.co.uk | info@xxxxxxx.co.uk ] [ 
https://avtree.co.uk/ | www.avtree.co.uk ]
07917XXXXXX
Company Registration Number: SC413171

----- Original Message -----
From: "trees" <trees@xxxxxxxxxx.co.uk>
To: "uktc" <uktc@xxxxxx.tree-care.info>
Sent: Monday, 27 July, 2020 16:38:39
Subject: Re: Hidden defects

Mike, David, please let's not disappear down this hole again as 
there seems to be no possibility of there being any light at the end of 
it.
The subject has been discussed at length previously and as the twain 
seem unlikely to meet, perhaps you should each go your own way.
I do appreciate that it's an important subject; it's just that it's 
never going to be resolved in this forum. I suggest your views would 
be better aired in something like the Arb Journal, where there's 
more room to expand and less opportunity for things to get over-heated.

Thanks
Jerry


On 27/07/2020 15:16, David Evans wrote:
<<I'm not sure that there's much need for a discussion on 
semantics. To
my mind our job is to look at a tree carefully (inspection) and 
assess any potential defects or symptoms of defects (assessment) to 
quantify - to the best of our ability - the risk. It's all part of 
the same process. However, we do need to find the potential defects 
in order to be able to assess them.>>
I'm sure there's absolutely nothing I agree with here.

Thanks. It's been a useful further exploration of what I think is
risk-averse, hazard-driven thinking that often comes with managing 
secondary risk (the risk of a claim against the 'inspector') with 
hindsight bias. Rather than managing the primary risk (from tree 
failure) which the duty holder is responsible for. It demonstrates 
why the duty holder having a strategy that tells us what 'our job is', is 
so important.
Cheers

Acer Ventura









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To unsubscribe send mailto:uktc-unsubscribe@xxxxxx.tree-care.info

The UKTC forum is supported by Bosky Trees arboricultural consultancy and
Stockholm Tree Pits
https://www.stockholmtreepits.co.uk